Death on the trail
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DrSaw
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« on: April 24, 2008, 09:12:34 PM »
As many of you heard, a rider with our Thursday ride died suddenly on the trail of a massive heart attack right in front of me on the trail at Gorgas la. It brought up an issue with the medics not having a key to Gorgas La gate. If this had not been a fatality, but a serious injury, this could have delayed life-saving treatment. Needs to be addressed.

Many riders were there helping out who were coming the other way. Some where giving CPR. I spent 2 hours in the ER with the wife telling her how well the MTB community tried to save him, and letting he know her husband died happy, with no pain, not being alone. She asks who ever was there to let me know; she wants to send thank you notices.

This is a wake-up call for everyone's group rides about safety, bail-out points, and nearest hospitals, and especially explaining to 911 where you are. This was one of the most fustrating parts.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2008, 09:49:25 AM by DrSaw » Logged
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dieselkarl
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« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2008, 09:32:09 PM »
My condolences to the man's family.   GPS is becoming an ever increasing part of our equipment base.  Here's a situation that could've eliminated some of the confusion over location.  It wouldn't have helped with the gate issue (a shaped charge would though.)  It's a chore to go thru the big old instruction book that comes with our fancy gadgets but after reading this, I'll be re-examining my little garmin's book.
I was involved with a situation in Fairhill that required ems to assist an injured person.  We had bigger GPS units with us and it sped up response time by giving the dispatcher exact co-ordinates to responders.

Karl
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Chuck U
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« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2008, 09:48:32 PM »
Bad stuff.

The little GPS systems can do location co-ordinates too.   Garmin 305 shows you the details if you go to the menu: navigation: mark location.  Might be another way too.   Trouble is that it might point them to a street address that is near but has no trail access.  That is if the local paramedics are equipped with GPS.   

Something we will have to address.   There are a lot of riders on these group rides....
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stymie
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« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2008, 11:05:53 PM »
That's terrible news. Condolences to his family. I hope everyone who was there helping is OK too - I know I would be pretty freaked out.

Regarding trail access, I recall Dave Dannenberg addressed this issue at a PMBA meeting a few months ago. From memory, he mentioned that one aspect of the Wissahickon trail system revamp is to dramatically improve trail signage. One specific aspect of this will be the installation of coded trail markers along all major trails. These markers, along with their exact location and nearest entry point. will be logged with emergency services. Once in place, this system should minimise any confusion or ambiguity regarding the location of an injured person, and consequently, greatly reduce the response time.
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fishnchips
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« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2008, 11:34:43 PM »
very sad news. just a guy out having fun like the rest of us.

I typed a message but lost it, so I'm keeping this short.

Very commendable of you Neil to stay at the hospital to support his family. It must hot have been easy. I can't imagine what they are going through.

It's nice to know that fellow riders stepped up to try and help. No doubt there was nothing more that could have been done.
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max
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« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2008, 06:24:44 AM »
this just speaks to the fact that we need trail markers along the trails that police (911) know about and can get too...

Dave Dannenburg is doing his best to make this happen but the city is dragging it's feet.

GPS is good but even with coordinates EMS won't know where you are on a trail...

my condolences to his wife and family!!!! so sad.
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madmavic
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« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2008, 06:30:56 AM »
that sucks he died. we tried our best to keep his heart/ breathing going. my thoughts are with his family.
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Anne Rock
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« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2008, 06:56:54 AM »
My heart goes out to his family.  One consolation would be that he was doing what he loved.  Many thanks to the mtbers that tried to assist; we truly have an awesome community. 

One Wednesday afternoon, we watched the Philadelphia Fire Company (Roxborough) spend over 1.5 hours trying to locate a wounded trail hiker in the Wiss.  They could not find him because (I'm guessing) he didn't know where he was and couldn't recommend access points and they didn't know the trails well enough to figure out from his description where he was.  Safety and emergency options are certainly topics that merit discussion.
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Dmitri
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« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2008, 07:26:14 AM »
I would like to add my condolences to the family, and thanks to the riders who were there trying to help and save his life.

This is indeed sad news.

Like Max said city and FPC are dragging their feet on establishing the system for a good trail identificatoin. As sad as this incident is, it might shake them up enough to things moving in the right direction.

Has anyone thought about PMBA starting up a little fund collection for flowers basket for the family.

I know it's been asked already, but was he a regular or new to our rides?

dz
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gcrowe
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« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2008, 07:33:45 AM »
I heard about this last night and was heart broken for is family.  If not for another obligation I may have been riding in that group.

2 points:
I noticed that Montgomery County recently installed emergency position markers along the Schuylkill River Trail. A simple but brilliant idea. Sometimes it takes a tragedy to get things done. What do we need to do to get this done?

From what I hear this rider was pretty young. 42? Mountain biking is very stressful and physical. Everyone should get a yearly physical and after 40, a stress test every 2 years. One never knows what may be lurking inside.
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bonkers
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« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2008, 08:06:31 AM »
Quote from: gcrowe on April 25, 2008, 07:33:45 AM
I heard about this last night and was heart broken for is family.  If not for another obligation I may have been riding in that group.

2 points:
I noticed that Montgomery County recently installed emergency position markers along the Schuylkill River Trail. A simple but brilliant idea. Sometimes it takes a tragedy to get things done. What do we need to do to get this done?

From what I hear this rider was pretty young. 42? Mountain biking is very stressful and physical. Everyone should get a yearly physical and after 40, a stress test every 2 years. One never knows what may be lurking inside.

OMG!! that's aweful! my prayers go out to the family..

Gcrowe- I work for Montgomery County & will find out how/what needs to be done to install those markers. Whatever info I can get I'll relay back to the group so preventative measures can be in place.
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MADDOG
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« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2008, 08:20:04 AM »
I just wanted to reiterate the importance of the local EMS/FD having access to the gates at the trail head.  I was one of the witnesses who directed the FD to the man on the trail.  Valuable time was lost when the FD had to walk down the trail and back up the hill to the man down.  It was a monumental task to even get a gurney and equipment close to the man.  If they had a key, or even cut the lock they could have saved many minutes both getting to the man and getting him out of the woods.   

The two guys performing CPR should be commended.  I’m not sure any of us there was formally trained in how to do it.  Which brings me to my next point.  It is important that everybody knows how to perform CPR.  Especially those who ride often and in sometimes extreme conditions.  Maybe the PMBA can sponsor a Red Cross CPR training day?   

Lastly - I heard someone say he had three kids.  I can't even imagine what  they are goping through.  Can PMBA/Lou or someone start a collection to maybe send some flowers or something?
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bonkers
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« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2008, 08:32:42 AM »
Maybe we should start looking at first aid training as a group (which could include CPR certification in some trainings). Like MADDOG said maybe we should all know a little something with CPR if we're out there w/the summer heat approaching.


I'm all for the collection too for flowers/donation to the family. 
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jomissa
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« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2008, 08:46:43 AM »
im sure the entire Philly Cycling community shares in the families sadness....just sad sad news
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jpearce
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« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2008, 09:09:23 AM »
Unbelievable - it could have been any of us, either as ride participants or the victim.  We take for granted the minor injuries that inevitably occur, but we don't usually have to face anything this serious.  Sounds like this incident would be a good topic for a PMBA meeting, to discuss how to be prepared if something like this happens.  Apparently Neil and the other riders managed it well, but I don't know if all of us would have done as good a job.  There should probably be some sort of plan for what a ride group should  do if something like this occurs - dealing with first aid, notification of police/EMTs, identifying the location in the park, etc.  Hopefully among the extended biking community we have enough experts to help design an appropriate plan.  There's apparently nothing that anyone could have done to help this poor guy, but the next incident might be different.
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Lou
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« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2008, 09:10:55 AM »
Anyone know his name? My heart goes out to his wife and family. Neil and everyone else that was there: great job at a very difficult task. As far as the man (wish I knew his name) I am sure he was having a great time (who isn't when biking in the Wiss?) If I had to choose how and where I go, this would be in the top five. We have a lot of work to do (PMBA) on this. I for one need to learn CPR becuase I don't know it and I would be really upset now if this happened and I couldn't do a thing to help him... ANyone know where we can take a class? I will look into a group rate for PMBA... We should commemorate this guy somehow as he is part of our family...

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Chuck U
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« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2008, 09:16:39 AM »
Lou, can we use PMBA funds to send flowers from the MTB community?
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Dmitri
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« Reply #17 on: April 25, 2008, 09:25:37 AM »
Quote from: dirtmerchant on April 25, 2008, 09:10:55 AM
I for one need to learn CPR becuase I don't know it and I would be really upset now if this happened and I couldn't do a thing to help him... ANyone know where we can take a class? I will look into a group rate for PMBA... We should commemorate this guy somehow as he is part of our family...

I think the best memory would be to champion the new trail marking system which has been pushed by FOW for years now, and finally get in place. Maybe we could carry the name in it, sort of like there are so many laws names after the cases which triggered their creation (Meghan's Law for example)

Secondly, Lou, contact Kevin Groves. In a strange twist of faith, FOW Trail Ambassadors were having CPR/First Aid training class that exact night. I've attended couple of these classes in the past, and must say, that this one was one of the better ones. It was taught by a real life Philly FD Paramedic, so there was a lot of first hand experience and real life tips included. Kevin will have the guy's contact info and all the details.

dz
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DrSaw
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« Reply #18 on: April 25, 2008, 09:33:07 AM »
Matt Chaplin was his name.

Lou, call me. I have contact info
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RepoMan
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« Reply #19 on: April 25, 2008, 09:34:56 AM »
This is really sad. It is encouraging, though, to hear how swiftly the community takes action when emergencies happen, especially since other park users are almost always the first responders out there.

How about a Forbidden Drive bench plaque in his name? I don't know what they cost or how you go about getting that done, though. I'd definitely be willing to chip in for something like that, or whatever is decided.



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vegancheesesteak
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« Reply #20 on: April 25, 2008, 09:47:30 AM »
I definitely agree on the CPR training.  I took a course in high school but dont remember much. Its one of those things you always thing about refreshing but never take the time to do. I think it would be useful for all of us if we could get a group one. Another thing is carrying the little first aid kits you can get at REI. There is a lot of useful stuff in those packs for lesser emergencies and even bigger ones (asprin etc). I was also thinking to start carrying Benadryl Strips in case someone in a group is allergic to bees. Last year a couple friends stirred up a bees nest on the trail and it was a pretty funny scene but could be serious with an allergic reaction and you are a long ways out.
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fishnchips
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« Reply #21 on: April 25, 2008, 09:48:02 AM »
Chuck, good idea, because I have some friend who are not joined yet with PMBA that want to express their condolences. If we can somehow represent the sentiment of everyone that would be great.

I think Neil said his name was Mark or Mike Chaplin(Corrected, Matt Chaplin). He showed up for one of their group rides and he was new, but had a a strong physique, a nice bike and all the proper gear including a garmin 305, so I take that to assume he was at least an experienced biker, if not MTB rider. It sounds like and the hospital assumed he had an undiagnosed condition.

Neil was able to tell his widow that it happened quickly and he was not alone. He said that she would very much like to thank all those who were with him and did what they could.

I'm always paranoid about safety in general and I think we should probably have a discussion category devoted to it, with stickies for beginner riders, CPR, basic emergency protocol, etc..
« Last Edit: April 25, 2008, 09:50:24 AM by fishnchips » Logged
Kelly
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« Reply #22 on: April 25, 2008, 10:02:46 AM »
My dad ordered some RoadIDs for the family for biking, running, etc. I strapped mine to my CamelBak so it's always there while riding. It has name, blood type, contact info, etc.

I'm not affiliated with RoadID or pushing them, but I'm happy with the product. It's well-made and tough and nice to know it's always there.
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Dmitri
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« Reply #23 on: April 25, 2008, 10:12:04 AM »
Posting for Dave Dannenberg (FOW):

Re: Death  in the Wissahickon

I read with interest and sadness of the death of a cyclist from heart
attack in the Wissahickon on Thursday. I heartily commend Neil and the
others who helped and cared for the man, even going so far as to go to
the hospital. It is an understatement to state that the experience is
not pleasant for anyone involved. However, the way the PMBA members
handled it was exemplary, and speaks volumes about the nature of the
PMBA membership.

The incident also speaks volumes about the inadequacies of the
signage, EMS, and wayfinding systems in the Wissahickon. As was
mentioned in several posts, with input from FPC and others IMBATS
generated relevant plans to fix the systems as part of the STI.  FOW
has been working with FPC as well as Fire Radio Dispatch, Streets
Department, Police Radio Dispatch, Mayor's Office on Information
Systems (MOIS--the City's GIS office) to establish an address system
for the entire trail system that is tied into the 911 system, and
clearly and simply conveyed on the trails, maps, and trial heads.

 From where I sit, there is general agreement about how to fix the
system. It is a matter now of getting it done, which is apparently not
simple. Anyone wanting copies of the ideas outlined in the STI is
welcome to them.

Again I am saddened by the man's death, but glad it was swift and
apparently painless, and am impressed with your handling of it.

David Dannenberg
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« Reply #24 on: April 25, 2008, 12:10:21 PM »
Wow, this is terribly sad news, my condolences to the family.
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« Reply #25 on: April 25, 2008, 12:24:30 PM »
Quote from: dirtmerchant on April 25, 2008, 09:10:55 AM
Anyone know his name? My heart goes out to his wife and family. Neil and everyone else that was there: great job at a very difficult task. As far as the man (wish I knew his name) I am sure he was having a great time (who isn't when biking in the Wiss?) If I had to choose how and where I go, this would be in the top five. We have a lot of work to do (PMBA) on this. I for one need to learn CPR becuase I don't know it and I would be really upset now if this happened and I couldn't do a thing to help him... ANyone know where we can take a class? I will look into a group rate for PMBA... We should commemorate this guy somehow as he is part of our family...




I know someone at HUP who is willing to teach us/PMBA for free and the class doesnt take long at all.
I need to know who she can email to try and set something up with PMBA. She sounds like she is willing to come out to the monthly meeting to teach us there.

Give me an email address so I can send it to her.

cheers,
Josef
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Rico
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« Reply #26 on: April 25, 2008, 01:18:11 PM »
My condolenses to his family.

Perhaps difibulators on parts of the trails would be a good idea as well.  Most golf