Chain strong enough for SS?...
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Dmitri
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« on: March 08, 2008, 10:11:07 PM »
I've been riding SS for 2-3 years now. And I seem to eat thru chains relatively quickly. I've used SRAM PC-58, and dropped those as too weak. Went thru two PC-68's now.
What have other singlespeeders have used? Or should I just resign to replacing the chain every 2-3 months as a wear item?

dz
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Chuck U
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« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2008, 07:59:20 AM »
Breaking them?  Or just wearing them out?
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gibsygoldtop
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« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2008, 10:55:22 AM »
Maybe 2-3 months is the life span. I just to had to replace mine as well. I was using a Shimano LX but switched to a Sram PC-991 as I was told that it was be stronger. I can't confirm that just yet.
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Lust4singletrack
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« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2008, 12:58:07 PM »
Try trimming that leg hair a little bit. That should do it.
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pahearn
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« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2008, 05:15:08 PM »
That's about the lifespan I get out of PC58's as well, and I'm happy with that. I used to run PC-1 for a while but I was replacing those every month I'd say. I've got a Wipperman something or other on the shelf to try next, but so long as it lasts as long as the PC58s I'll be happy.

-pete
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Chuck U
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« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2008, 06:53:54 PM »
Thats about what I get out of mine too, but I don't let em get stretched out too much.  The smaller front ring and rear cog really puts a hurt on the chain.

What lube are you using?  I switched from prolink/home brew to boesheild last summer when it was dusty and that made a big difference.  I have a new sram 870 on it and so far it seems to being good, but maybe it's just time of year and cleaner.

Road single speed I went to a full track chain (HKK Vertex/Izumi Model V) and noticed a huge difference.  But they are heavy and really expensive so I'm not sure if it comes out ahead in the end.  Plus, I'm not sure how they would fair in dirt.   Still, I might eventually try one at some point.  They do have a really awesome bolt on master link that makes getting the chain off and on super easy, maybe even easier than a powerlink (though a flat screwdriver and 7mm wrench is needed).

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max
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« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2008, 07:16:31 PM »
honestly the cheapest of the cheap kmc chains.... they are as good as anything else on the cheap side and can be had under 10 bucks.

mine seem to last around 6 months so i don't know what you babboons are doing to your bikes, but try riding a little more delicately...  Grin Grin Grin Grin

i get like 4 months out of a fixed gear chain on my commuter bike...

i had a small stockpile of shimano ig-90 chains for a bit. those were nice i swear they used to last almost a full year on my ss. i guess i ride more now though.
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Dmitri
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« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2008, 07:32:40 AM »
Mostly not breaking, tho I had broken one or two Sram PC-58s.
I have a Prolink chain checker that checks the "stretch" but more like the wear on the rollers, and it's indicating that the chain is up for replacement ever 2-3 months.
I hear you Max. I've stuck with PC58s for so long cos I used to pick them up on sales for just over $10. Then I got few PC68s when I saw them on sale for something like $13-14
I'm looking at KMC Z410, it's cheap and hopefully will last as long. I guess I'll get 2-3 of them so that I don't have to be bothered to re-order and wait.

I used to swear by Prolink Gold or whatever it's called. But got turned onto DuMonde Tech Lube and I'm loving it. Takes a while to build up the coating on the new chain, but after that, it requires re-application only every 3-5 rides and stays farily dry, not to attract too much dust and dirt. It's not that easy to find tho...

Thanks guys.

dz

PS Max, you saw my cog I keep in the car... It's all pure power, baby!    Roll Eyes
« Last Edit: March 10, 2008, 07:43:02 AM by DZM3 » Logged
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fishnchips
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« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2008, 10:33:13 AM »
After reading this SS chain talk I thought I'd take a look at mine.

I'm using the cheapo SRAM PC-1 $10 chain (regarded as pretty crappy on MTBR). You know my size and weight, well, I've put 700 mostly Wiss miles on it. I drop some lube on it sometimes, but I've never cleaned the drivetrain once. So far, no slips or breaks at all.

On the geared bike I've broken new chains 3 times in a week. I don't have the confidence to stand and crank simply because I fear the chain breaking. It all comes down to lateral forces, and if you cross your chain a lot it gets weak quickly. However, in SS mode, with a straight chainline, it's much harder to break.

But the main reason I think my SS drivetrain has lasted this long is because the drivetrain includes a tensioner. It helps to balance the load throughout the rotation rather than straining links in certain areas. Virtually no drivechain is perfectly aligned and no cogs or chainrings are perfectly round, and without a tensioner you'll have areas in the movement that are tighter than others.

Surly has a lot to say about the SS drivetrain: http://www.surlybikes.com/spew3.html
And check out there other "Spews". I think somewhere they also recommend to go with a quality 8 or 9 speed chain because those tend to be manufactured at the highest most refined quality. (of note, I've found the $20 tensioner from performance offers a lot more spring tension than the Singulator).

There are a lot of subtleties though, especially with the cogs and chainrings you use. But I'm inclined to agree with Surly that you need to have an 18t or larger rear cog, and you should experiment with making the front chainring bigger rather than the back cog smaller. Fewer teeth mean less grab and more wear. More teeth means the opposite, and the weight difference is virtually inconsequential.

Right now I'm running 32 20 on the 29er SS, but I think I will soon go to 33 or 34 20. I'm sure having the 20 cog also accounts for the long lasting chain.)
« Last Edit: March 10, 2008, 10:35:13 AM by fishnchips » Logged
Kelly
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« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2008, 10:55:38 AM »
Good point on the bigger cogs = more teeth and less leverage on the chain and should last longer.   I like my 32 tooth for clearance so I'll stick with it.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chains.html#wear  this is the method I use to tell if a chain is shot or not.  It doesn't include roller wear but works for me.

Oh, my chain tension is even all the way around.  White Industries FTW!   Tongue  Which brings up a point, don't over tighten your chain. That will kill it!
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Lust4singletrack
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« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2008, 04:33:04 PM »
My geared bikes usually last 6 months to a year. I try to always shift smooth and clean my chain regularly. I don't ride my ss enough to know how long that would last.
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dieselkarl
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« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2008, 07:18:35 PM »
Whipperman/conex whitestar's.  It's a track/bmx chain.  It's 1/8" wide as opposed to 3/32 for 8sp.  It utilizes a master link.  I've run into issues where it won't work with some chain tensioners but other than that, it's bomber.  I think I have some on the parts shelf for $18.

Karl
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max
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« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2008, 09:23:02 AM »
karl - i just threw a wipperman on my fixed gear.... thing looks like a beast! we will see how it holds up.

fish - i think the bigger cog thing holds a lot of merit too. i run a 34x21 and i think it may just be the bigger cogs that makes my chain last longer?

gonna throw a new chain on my ss soon for "racin" season. the old one probably isn't even stretched too bad yet but i like going into the summer on a new chain.
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fishnchips
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« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2008, 11:53:08 AM »
I'm up to 750 miles now. The chain I'm using is also 1/8". I think Surly says 1/8" doesn't work with the old singulator tensioners so they changed the design. I know it works with the PB and Nashbar generic tensioners.

SRAM's chain has a fat link which acts the same but is a bit bit differently than their quick links. Every now and then I can here the link clip the tensioner guide, but it's not been a problem. Also, I ran a half link on my previous SS with the same tensioner. The half link was huge, sort of bigger than the rest of the chain. but again, I didn't have a problem, and I assume it's because of the larger cogs and tensioner.

Also, my cogs are steel, not sure that makes a difference.

Interesting MAX that you are running 34x21 instead of stepping the back cog down. Are you running a tensioner too or eccentric BB? The weight issue is insignificant, but I guess it takes some clearance away going over logs and such. My guess is that is not much of a difference either?
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Kelly
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« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2008, 08:00:42 PM »
if you hop a log properly ring clearance is never an issue anyway. go big!

logs and chainrings....  Grin

http://tuktok.com/loghop/
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fishnchips
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« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2008, 10:06:06 PM »
great pictures! Believe it or not I have that technique down for logs up to about 10 inches, but I pretty much walk anything larger because I'm scared.

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Kelly
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